Episode 14: Black Girl/White School: A conversation with Olivia V.G. Clarke

In this episode, we talk about the experiences of black girls in all white education spaces with Olivia V.G. Clarke and Theresa Clarke. Olivia is the author of Black Girl, White School: Thriving, Surviving and No, You Can’t Touch My Hair. We discuss Olivia’s book and her personal experiences at home and in school which led her to its creation. Her mother, Theresa, discusses how she realized the value of the book and how she wishes she had a book like this when she was growing up.

We discuss:

- The creation of Olivia’s book

- The book’s appeal to a wide range of black women in different situations 

- The two drastically different journals that accompany the book

…and more!

Here are some highlights:

Olivia’s Idea For the Book

“The first idea like the first inkling of the book happened about a year and a half ago,” Olivia said. “And I was just walking home from school with my mom one day. And we were just talking about, you know, life as we do. And I mentioned that I had an idea and how cool would it be to have a collection of you know, stories, essays, anecdotes, etc, etc, written by black girls about black girls and the black female experience at predominantly white institutions. And she just looked at me and was like, Yes, do that. So then I was like, Okay, I should probably write this book. And because I'm a procrastinator, I didn't start until about a year ago.”

“It started off with me reaching out to black girls that I knew from campus, you know, from schools and saying, like, ‘Hey, I'm writing this book. Do you have an essay, a poem, something you wanted it put out Google Forms?’ My mom helped me set up a website, actually, where I had a Google form there for them to enter in whatever they wanted. The book is in sections. One of the examples is “I’m Not Her” section. And that's one thing that me and my friends at my school talked about a lot right before the book came out, was just always being called each other's names. And no one ever being able to tell us apart.”

Olivia’s Experience of Being Erased 

“The last time because of my race and gender was when talking about police brutality at school,” Olivia said, “and the erasure of black women in that conversation as well. And having to deal with that. Having to represent all black people with my thoughts and feelings. “

Olivia’s Reasoning for the Book Being an Anthology

“The last part of the book or the title, I should say, and the main reason why I wanted it to be an anthology was to let other people insert their own experiences,” Olivia says. “Because I don't have the same experiences as other black girls do in other parts of the country, in their individual schools. And I wanted to make sure that there was a wide range of experience, because the youngest authors and middle school and the oldest have already graduated college and moved on into the workforce. So I wanted to make sure that it had a wide range of experiences and black women and diverse experiences, so that it can be helpful to everyone.”

Theresa Shares Her Thoughts on Her Daughter, Olivia, Writing a Book

“Since Olivia is our first we call her our experimental child,” Says Theresa. “We never know really what to expect until it happens, right? Olivia’s that ground breaker and kind of lays the path. So when she comes up with things, we kind of treat it as, ‘okay, so this must be what the kids are doing.’ So for her to come up with a such a brilliant idea . . . it stopped me in my tracks. It was one of those moments that I looked at her and I'm like, ‘you got to do that.’ That's needed. I wish I had that. I got excited about the idea and then I wanted to make sure I didn't do that mom thing where you come in, and you take over.”

“And so I wanted to make sure that she knew that she had me and my husband's support, you know, as always, but that she would have to kind of drive this bus and measure it too. You know, she's got a lot going on, school and everything. And so I did not want what was a great idea to become a chore. I went to an independent all girls school had a lot of the same experiences. My husband and I went to predominantly white institutions, all of most of our school career. So we thought we really prepared her for what she would encounter, as we both learned when she was doing the book and reading the book is that it’s different having parents share experiences with you, and then experiencing it yourself.”

Olivia Talks About the Response of Her Classmates to Her Book

Before I publish it, I didn't really tell anyone, besides the people I was reaching out to,” Olivia says. “Because at first I was a little nervous. I didn't know what the reaction was going to be in my circle, or outside of it. But it was really, really nice. I mean, I haven't had a single person at my school, or administrators, teachers, students or whatever, have a negative reaction.”

“ I know that a lot of the first pre-sale books were from my friends, and from my teachers who wanted to learn more and who wanted to support me. So that was really nice. Because one thing that I'm grateful for is I don't let any of the negativity that I've gotten from the book get to me. I mean, I don't really know, I always say I don't really care. It's just that that was not the purpose.”

Olivia Talks About Wanting Interactivity with the Book

“During the editing process I was talking to my mom and my dad about how can I make this more interactive,” Olivia says. “I thought about maybe making a journal maybe doing like a web show or something. Other ways that I could continue the conversation after the book. And so eventually, I settled on creating two separate journals. So the first one, which is currently already out on Amazon is “Black Girl/White School: The Journal.” And this journal is just for black girls. And it pairs with the book, it's for black girls to talk about their days, there's journaling, affirmations, things like that, to help them as they read the book to reflect on their own experience, as well. And then the second journal is the Ally Journal, which is currently up for pre-sale, which is meant for non black allies and administrators to think about how they can be a better ally, to think about how they perpetuate certain stereotypes in their own schools, where they are lacking and where they are, what their strengths are, and how they can work on themselves better.”

Olivia’s View on why Independent Private Schools are so Difficult for Black Girls

“I think the first piece of it is the cultural shock and the environmental difference,” says Olivia. “I came from a predominantly black school in Columbus city school system and then moved into an independent predominantly white institution. I just wasn't used to it. I mean, from where I was raised everyone looked like me. And also because the socioeconomic status piece of it was also another thing because I was used to everyone to be middle class or middle class poor, like no one really thought about it.”

“Whereas in my school, everyone was really wealthy. And I think a lot of the experiences of black culture that they are used to comes from media, and it comes from music, it comes from TV shows, and comes from movies. And that's not always an accurate representation of who we are, especially as black women. You see us portrayed in media, you see us as angry, as sassy. It’s one dimensional. And then that's how they think they need to interact with us, they need to add that blackcent they need to start using AAVE, to start trying to act more black.”

Olivia’s Thoughts on the Over Sexualization of Black Females

“It was a Princeton study that found adults see black girls from the age of four and five, as more mature as more sexual and in less need of help and nurturing than white peers of the same age,” Olivia says. “And that's also dangerous. These adults can be in law enforcement and these adults run the schools and that is dangerous on an emotional and physical level for black girls. And that was also something that I really thought about what writing the book.”

Olivia’s Website

https://oliviavgclarke.com

Purchase Black Girl / White School here.

Purchase Black Girl / White School Journal here.

Amazon link for the Ally Journal here

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Intro music by https://instagram.com/mikedupreemusic